INTRO:
Hey everyone. Welcome to the Healing Everyday Podcast, stories and conversations to inspire you to be in the driver's seat of your life. Walk along up.
VICTOR:
Hey everybody. Welcome to the Healing Everyday Podcast. My name is Victor,
DEANNA:
And I'm Deanna.
VICTOR:
What's going on, Deanna?
DEANNA:
Not much. We, uh, we both work today, Victor and I, I mean, we're so jam-packed in schools right now, and we kind of have been since I joined you. Mm-hmm. . Um, but we were actually both at the same school today, which was awesome. We got to commute together. Um, Victor, you got to present to elementary. I got to present to middle school, which is my favorite, and I think it went really well. How was your day?
VICTOR:
It was, it was great. Um, it's very interesting, not, you know, we have a lot of great things to talk about today, but a quick little story today, I was, I was doing, uh, a third grade presentation and I, I literally said in the presentation, if anyone is connecting to my story, I want you to, you know, privately raise your hand when you leave here today and don't keep on safe secrets. And it was just a very interesting situation cuz a girl in the back of the room, she went like this. She nodded her head like, yes, I, this has happened to me. And at that moment, you know, I don't say anything. I don't do anything. I just keep rolling with it and then I don't forget her. And then I tell the social worker about her at the end, and it, it was just now, whatever that means, whatever, whatever it is for her. I just think the fact that when kids respond like that, um, it's, it's just amazing. And, and, and I say amazing in the sense that, you know, it's great that if, if it is the case that she can get the help that she needs.
DEANNNA:
Yeah. We, and we've talked about this on the podcast before, having like red flag reactions, not that the kid is bad, but that they are giving some indication that they're connecting. And that's why having those follow up check-ins are so important. So yeah, it went really
Speaker 2 (02:04):
Good. Yeah, it was a great day. So we, enough talking about us. Uh, I'm excited because we have as our second guest on the Healing Everyday podcast.
Speaker 3 (02:13):
Yes. Super excited. I wanna take a minute and introduce Torrie. I actually met Torrie of all places on TikTok and I honestly, I, I think it was through, uh, you know, healing and talking about sexual assault, sexual violence content. So, Torrie, welcome. How are You?
TORRIE:
Hey, I'm fantastic. Thank you so much for having me. Yeah, I'm pretty sure I saw what you guys do and I was like, I need to know more about this . I think that's what originally, uh, brought me in, like speaking in schools and all of that. Yeah.
DEANNA:
Why are you trying to be a presenter, Tori?
TORRIE:
I dream, I dream of it. I literally do. I would absolutely love to. Yeah. . So I'm happy to be here, as you can see.
VICTOR:
That's so great. You got a great smile, Torrie. And, and thank you. Uh, thank you for joining us tonight. I know you could be doing a million other things, but um, we're honored to have you, uh, with us. Yeah,
TORRIE:
Thank you.
DEANNA:
Yeah. And, um, you know, just, just a quick disclaimer. So for our listeners, we, we do talk about, you know, a whole host of different types of, of trauma and just giving a quick trigger warning. Um, you know, whatever Tori feels comfortable sharing with us tonight, um, it's always okay to take breaks to come back to the podcast whenever you need to. Um, but tonight we kind of wanna hear about Tori's experiences in life and, and how she is really healing every day. And Torrie, just like we talked about before, you know, we might ask a couple of questions, chat a little bit and, and so if you wanna tell us about, um, a little bit about yourself and your story, we'd, we'd love to hear it. And so would our listeners.
TORRIE:
Of course. Thank you. And before I start my official story, um, I am gonna be talking about two different trauma experiences, major trauma moments in my life. And I want to say for anybody listening, it's never a victim's responsibility to report. Our only responsibility is to heal. And I say that because the way I have chosen to heal through my different traumas are unique from each other because trauma is just that our experiences are unique and so the way we heal through them is different. Um, even the same person experiencing trauma heals through them differently. Um, but my earliest memory is not a very good one. Um, I'm about three years old and I'm playing hide and seek with somebody who was a trusted family friend. And, um, that is when ab abuse was first introduced to me. And, uh, sexual abuse was introduced to me as a game.
So as a kid that was incredibly confusing. And um, the acts that were done were not what I as a child would consider violent and, um, abu quote unquote abusive, even though it was abuse. Um, but because it was introduced as a game, it again left me very confused. Um, and it was pretty isolated occurrences. It wasn't an ongoing thing. That being said, the acts that were done left me as a kid. Again, confused is the best word I can find because abuse is confusing in general. And when you don't know what abuse is, you don't know what to do with that, which we, you know, lock that away in our, um, unconscious mind there. And um, like I said, the abuse happened when I was three and I would say the rest of my childhood was actually pretty normal or what I would consider to be normal. Um, I grew up in a, um, pretty religious household and I was homeschooled until seventh grade with a Christian curriculum and spent, I don't know if you knew that about me, Deanna. Um, I spent
DEANNA:
Mostly vaguely. Vaguely. I vaguely, yes, I vaguely remember. Yeah.
Cause I know we have both kind of touched on religious trauma before. Um, but yeah, hearing that you were homeschooled until seventh grade Wow.
TORRIE:
Wow. Yeah, and again, with the Christian curriculum and spent most of my time hanging out with my church friends and going to youth groups and all of that growing up, um, if anyone's familiar with Awana, um, it was a major church program going up as well. Um, so you can imagine my knowledge when it came to sexual abuse, even when I was at an age where I could start learning about these things, was very limited. So this memory that I had of these isolated events got locked away and my memory cabinet, um, unsure how to process it because I knew that what had happened was wrong. I did not understand why or, um, exactly what was wrong about it. And I pulled all the shame onto myself for it. Um, because I didn't know how to process it. And because most of my education around sex and sexual assault growing up, um, was basically stranger danger.
And I knew and trusted this person who did these things. I had no idea how to handle it, how to process it. I did not know it was abuse. So I locked that memory away for a very, very long time. Um, and again, throughout my childhood, I can look back now and there were certain things I did where I was trying to make sense of my abuse and got in trouble for those things, um, because I, they weren't things that kids should be doing. That being said, um, I again was just trying to make sense of it and I can look back at those moments in my life and be like, oh, it had affected you back then, um, but you just didn't know what to do. Cuz for a long time I thought, oh, that memory just didn't affect me until it came back up in my adult life.
Mm-hmm. Um, but I can see now looking back, , it affected everything. Um, but like I said, I had what I thought was a pretty normal childhood growing up. And, um, besides being, like I said, I would say hypersexual in some situations that I always felt like a bad kid. I felt like there was something inherently bad about me growing up. And I think a lot of that has to do with the church messages that I was receiving at the same time, while also being the only person who knew what had happened to me and the only person who could try to decipher what that meant. And as a kid we don't understand a lot of things, so figuring those things out on our own is not easy. Um,
DEANNA:
And then, you know, what I think is was wild Torrie as well is is that that grooming piece of being told, you know, whether it's it's a game or to keep it a secret, that kind of compounds when we're also taught that our body is shameful or that being sexual in any way and we are sexual beings is taught that it's a bad thing. So it just kind of compounds that shame in that silence. You know, it's, it's very difficult to work through that confusion.
TORRIE:
Right. And again, any moment moving forward, anything sexual, I connected to that memory because I didn't have the, um, separation between assault and sex. I, to me, they were in my head combined because nobody had explained that separation to me. Anything sexual was wrong and sexual abuse was not explained. So they were all just, everything was grouped together. So even growing up into my teen years, like any time, you know, I kissed somebody, it like led me back to this shame path where I just felt this intense shame that I had done something wrong. Um, and kind of fast forward, like I said, I didn't think it affected me that much. Now looking back, I can tell it has. Um, but fast forward to uh, me being a teenager in, uh, 2009, the beginning of 2009, me and my family went on a cruise and um, like I said, I was a teenager.
I just turned 16 and, uh, it was just my family on the cruise. And I as a teenager did not want to spend a lot of time with my family at that time. I wanted to hang out with people my age and do what I considered fun, cool things. Um, so on the first night of the cruise, my parents brought me to the Teens Club that was on the ship. There was different childcare programs and different age groups. And the one I went to was for ages 15 and 17 years old, or between ages and 15 and 17. And, um, they met the childcare director there and they thought that would be safer for me than roaming the ship on my own, making friends. And, uh, there was a group of about six other people, or six other kids, I should say, teenagers in this kid's club.
And, um, my parents obviously thought this was a great place. So I stayed there, most of the crews, um, just hanging out during the day and hanging out with the kids in there. On the first day of the cruise, I was introduced to another employee of the ship, a dancer. And I was introduced to him by the childcare director, the teen club coordinator. And she introduced us to him as somebody who was a lot of fun to hang out with. And we'd probably be seeing a lot of him cuz he spends a lot of time there. And he is so fun. And instantly I was like, oh, this is so cool. I was the only girl in this group of kids. So I was like, had a major crush on this older guy who was now going to be hanging out with us. Um, he spent every single day in the Teens Club with us playing games.
I remember there was like a, we, so we were playing, we golf and bowling and all of the originals. Um, and, um, he just was a lot of fun. Spent every day with us. And as a 16 year old who is on a vacation with her family, this older guy paying attention to me in any aspect was exhilarating. Like, I felt amazing. I felt so cool. And, um, like I said, every day on the ship he would hang out with us. And I remember he would always make comments like about me being so mature for my age and so fun to hang out with and like, we should definitely keep in touch all this stuff. So I am, again, feeling on top of the world, um, that specific phrase when somebody says you're mature for your age. Um, that's something that I have been
So like, that was like, okay, like good person, let's go. Um, he's saying all these things that are true. Um, and then on the last night of the cruise, we were watching a movie. So there's different days on the cruise ship, I should explain this. There's at sea days and then you have port days. So port days you stop at a destination, you usually get out for the day, come back to the ship, and then there's at sea days. And so on the last day of the ship, it was an at sea day. So we were on our way back, uh, to California and, uh, me and the other teenagers were watching Pineapple Express in the Teens Club. And I remember the dancer came into the room and sat down next to me on like this tiny chair I was sitting on. And I just remember thinking like, it's wild now cause I can feel my teenage self have those feelings.
I remember feeling so cool and just like so excited that he wanted to sit next to me. Um, and then I remember he hel, he reached out and held my hand behind the chair and I was like, oh my gosh, all these things you've thought were in your head are becoming real, like he really likes you. Um, and again, in my head, I was a teenager not thinking about this being an adult actively preying on a child in a teens club where he knows the ages of the people who are in there. Um, and then at some point during the movie, he told me to meet him outside of the teens club at a specific door. And he said, um, once he leaves, just leave a little bit after him. So I remember he got up and left and about 15 seconds later I got up and left and, uh, went to where he told me to go.
And that door was actually the backstage, uh, dressing room door to the cruise ship. Like I said, he was a dancer, so we had access to the backstage dressing rooms. And, um, when we, when I first got there, I remember he pulled me in and locked the door behind me. And, um, again, without going into too much detail here, um, what started out in there was consensual or what I thought to be consensual. I thought I was actively agreeing, um, in what I was doing. And then at some point he asked me if I had done a few different things and his mood completely shifted and he only wanted to do things that I had not done before. And I was very insistent that I did not want to do, um, those things. And he was very insistent that they were going to happen regardless.
Um, at that point I left my body and what I know now is dissociation. I dissociated and I remember catching glimpses of myself because the way the dressing room is set up, I don't know if you've ever been in this, this type of dressing room, but there's, you know, mirrors that line, two of the walls. And so there's just mirrors everywhere. And so again, now thinking about that, um, and catching glimpses of myself is incredibly triggering. Um, and that kind of led onto stuff later in my life. That being said, I left my body. Um, and the next thing I remember is I am back in my cruise state room and I was sharing a room with my brother and sister and cousin at the time. And, uh, nobody was in the room when I was there. And I just remember going straight to the bathroom and there was just a lot of blood.
And, um, I remember at that point coming back to my body and thinking, wow, I'm so proud of you for making through that. That was my first thought was that like, wow, you did it. You did it. You like, you made it through it. And because there was this part of me that was still crushing on this guy I had spent this entire week with that I thought genuinely liked me, um, and being in physical pain at the same time. Um, and it again, very different from my first, um, experience of sexual abuse because this was painful and I knew, I knew that something again was not right mm-hmm. that this should not have happened, but I still didn't know how to categorize it because again, abuse is so confusing. There are so many layers to it, um, especially when you think , that you are actively choosing something and you don't, and there's a power imbalance there that you don't have the knowledge of. Um, and so after that, I knew something bad had happened, but I did not know how to categorize it. Again, at this moment, my education on sex and sexual assault is incredibly limited. Um, I had started public school at that point, but I don't remember a single sexual assault education class of any sort. And
VICTOR:
You were in, and at this point you were in Wisconsin, correct?
TORRIE:
Yes. Correct.
VICTOR:
And I mean, still to this day, Wisconsin doesn't have any mandatory sexual, you know mm-hmm. , no sexual friends law, no mandatory sexual abuse education. So, uh, if you don't mind me asking, what, what year was this that you were in?
TORRIE:
This Was in 2009.
VICTOR:
Okay. Yeah, Yeah, yeah. Torrie, what, um, he obviously was an adult, right? He
VICTOR:
Was a adult, right? Yep. In his twenties, probably.
TORRIE:
Yep. I'm not sure exact age, but he was definitely in his twenties. Yeah.
VICTOR:
Wow. Nice. Right, right.
TORRIE:
You know, and that yeah, that piece of dissociation is, I mean, I, I remember times as a kid and where I, I swear I was floating above and watching things happen. That's Exactly what it felt like. And I felt crazy for feeling that way for so long because it literally felt like I was above myself, like looking in. Right. But I, yeah, had, did not have the words, did not have anything to explain that at the time or, um, afterwards for that ma for another decade almost. I mean, it took me, took me a long time. Yeah. And so, um,
VICTOR:
Not to interrupt you, but it, it's interesting. People have asked me questions like, well, why didn't you just stop it from happening? Right. Well, I think it's perfect example of what you're saying. It's funny, I'm looking down at you on my screen, but I really need up here. I can look at, you know, the people can see me anyway, um, disassociation, right? We're not, I, I felt so out of control and that, like, you're not in control of that situation. And it's like, I felt numb. That's how I described it. I, I was just a numbing feeling. Like I didn't know what was going on. It was a very confusing, and that's how, again, without any education and, and at least awareness of the, of the situation of these kinds of things, you, you can't really pinpoint like what was happening at that point. Right. And that, not to go backwards for one second, when this first happened to you, when you were three H, how old was the person that did that to you when you were three?
TORRIE:
They were an adult.
VICTOR:
They were an adult. And, and again, I'm not trying to connect us to the church by any means, but you did up church. Was this a church incident that happened in the church? It Was, it was not. It was Not, it was not. Okay. I just wanted, I'm just trying to put context on it. Um, right, okay. Okay, good. Okay.
TORRIE:
And It's, and it's interesting, and this could, this conversation could go on for days too. Um, because with the church specifically, there are instances throughout like my teenage years where there was, there was emotional grooming with the church. I remember, like I had a youth group leader that wrote me a love letter one time and then got really upset when I acted weird about it. And like, there were weird relationships for sure that should not have happened. And I think that led up to me having a misguided representation of what adult teenager relationships look like and what grooming is. I mean, my, my assaulter and my teens was betting on the fact that I didn't have sexual assault education. You know what I mean? He was betting on the fact that I didn't know what was grooming was that it's weird for an adult to go into a teens club where he knows there's, that max age is going to be 17 years old and is still interact. Like it's weird when adults interact with children like that, it's not cool. We're not special. There's no kid to mature , you know, so mature that an adult can have that relationship with them.
DEANNA:
Well, and for the grooming piece, you know, um, I I, I was, I was raised, uh, you know, Lutheran not, not bagging on anybody's religion whatsoever. I, I support what people believe. However, I, I remember being told like, you listen to your parents no matter what you respect authority. And we talked about this on the last podcast, how you don't get to, you can, you can try and compartmentalize pieces of your life, right? Like I talked about how work life and home life and friendships, they're actually all the same thing. And you can be the same person wherever you are. But the thing is, is when we learn that emotional grooming or that respect authority, no matter what, even in, in instances of abuse that doesn't stay in a religious aspect, it, it does bleed over to every other aspect of our life. So, I mean, you know, Victor as a kid, um, not to drag Victor in, into, you know, his story, but you know, he was taught to be seen and not hurt by his dad. His dad loved him, you know, his dad wanted to see him, but didn't, didn't really wanna have that time, that emotional piece. So Victor made the connection, well, this must be in all aspects, not just about my day or about my friends. You know, so we download this belief that we are to be seen and not heard.
TORRIE:
Right. Well, and as, I mean, as humans, we only know what we know. So as kids, we're trying to make sense and teenagers we're trying to make sense of our surroundings based on the knowledge and the education that we have received. So I think of my brain as like a filing cabinet when I'm, when I experience something, I'm trying to find the most relevant thing to help me make sense of what just happened. And when you don't have something that's close to it, when you're sexually abused, you don't have something to connect it to. You connect it to the most, the closest thing that you can think of, you know, that makes sense. And a lot of the times it's those teachings that aren't meant to make that connection for you, but they do. Cuz that's how our brains work
DEANNA:
. Right.
VICTOR:
You know, Um, not to switch gears, but Okay. So, uh, is that, those are the two incidents that happened in your life, Correct?
TORRIE:
Yeah.
VICTOR:
So my question is then I, I'd like to know what, what was it for you that said, okay, I need to start talking about it. Was there one specific time or, and then how did that lead to where you are today? I know that's a, that's a huge time that we have, uh, but it's good to know that, and and was it a specific incident that caused you to be like, you know, I'm done. I I can't keep this because I'm assuming you're having a lot of triggers, right? I mean, just the fact that you're in a room with mirrors, right? I'm assuming brought back a ton of things. And that's con I mean, you're in addressing room at a store, you know, you're, you're around mirrors, you're, you know, you're, you're getting ready during the to, to go out mirrors. Right? So I'm sure that became part of your triggering process.
TORRIE:
Yeah. Oh, absolutely it did. And, um, I didn't realize at the time that it was constantly triggering me, but, um, in high school I was in the theater department and I Oh wow. Loved being in theater. And, um, yeah, like I have nightmares about my high school theater, um, and I'm in my high school theater and there's abuse happening. Um, but yeah, I would say what kind of got me to start talking about it and realizing that something had happened and I needed to, I needed to heal. Like something needed to happen, um, happened over a long course of time. Um, I, me and my family, like I said, I didn't realize what had happened on the cruise was abuse at the time. I knew something was really off about it. I knew I could never tell anybody about it. Um, I had locked it away as something that just will go to me with my grave, along with my assaults at three years old.
That's how I, I kind of told myself I can get through. It is okay. You're just never gonna tell anybody. It never happened. They're never gonna tell anybody. It's fine. And just don't think about it. And I know I've heard you guys say this on your videos before, just don't think about it. Because anytime I would think about it, I would just get caught in this shame circle and I couldn't fathom that it wasn't my fault. And so I just, I just couldn't think about it because it was too heavy. It was just too heavy. Um, and then me and my family had actually gone on a couple cruises after that. It was like our way to family vacation for a while. And every time we would come back from a cruise, I would go in this downward spiral and have no idea why. Um, and the next cruise that we went on after that, um, it was a year later and my grades plummeted.
I, um, got diagnosed with panic disorder, but I had no idea why I was panicking. I went to a therapist, uh, like I said, about a year after the first, uh, cruise assault. And we had, like I said, we got on another cruise a year after that assault. And when we came back from that cruise, um, like I said, I was having major panic attacks. Seeing people kiss would make me feel like the man was attacking her. Like, I hated anybody showing any signs of affection. Um, and that effect started to affect all of my relationships because I like being close with people. And I couldn't stand seeing people portray affection to other people or to myself. Um, and then, like I said, um, at about 18 years old, I had gone to therapy or a therapist because I was like, something is not right.
Um, and what kept coming up in my brain is the abuse from three years old. And, um, so I had gone to this therapist and I remember trauma dumping on them and just telling everything I knew about that memory and, um, not including the cruise story. Um, and I remember they had, uh, prescribed me some medication and they're like, this will help you go on your way. And again, I was at 18 years old, they didn't explain really what panic disorder was. They were just like, medicate and go away. And this is not to knock medication. I'm on medication now. Um, it just was not the right setup for me at the time. I needed so much more support, um, mentally. And um, when I went to go see that therapist, I had written a letter to my husband cause um, I believe he was my fiance at the time.
I had written him a letter that told him what had happened when I was three years old, convinced that he was going to leave me because I just felt like the dirtiest, shameful person ever. Um, but I was like, I have to tell him I have to tell somebody. Um, and I felt like he couldn't, he couldn't love me if he didn't fully know me. And I felt like he needed to know that. And again, that's not true. You don't need to disclose in order to be loved. Um, but I just felt this urge, like I had to tell him him. So I wrote him a letter and I remember he was like, that's awful. Like, I'm so sorry that happened. And he obviously did not leave. And he gave me the support that I needed. That being said, I was still in a time of heavy dissociation.
And so I kind of locked all of that away, um, until until 2019 essentially. Um, and we go on another cruise and I come back from that cruise and it set me into the worst depression that I have ever been in, in my life. Um, and again, I felt like it was out of the blue because I had told my husband about this first abuse. I had seen a therapist once before about it. That's all I needed. They said I was good. Like I had no idea what was happening and my body would just react to everything. Um, and so at the end of 2019, I finally found a therapist and started seeing her again. Um, started, sorry. Started seeing, seeing her in the first place, um, seeing a therapist again. And, um, we started talking about the abuse from three years old. And that led into noticing where I felt that in my body.
And then I remember her asking me one time, okay, when you focus on that pain in your stomach, um, what other memories come up? What other connections? Um, when, when else have you felt this, this way? And I remember instantly in my head it was like the cruise. And um, and again, I had never told a single person about that yet. Um, and I decided to tell my therapist that day and she was like, that is absolutely abuse. Um, and no wonder you're feeling this way. Um, and I remember at that point it took me a little bit, but I, um, sat my husband down, um, I think maybe a month after that. It took me a while to process it, to even be able to talk about it with him. Um, and I remember I sat him down and told him again thinking that he is just gonna think the worst of me.
I've already told him shameful stuff about my past. Um, because I still felt that it was somehow my fault. And, um, so I finally told my husband and he was, oh my goodness, this the best person ever, um, asked me what I needed from him and what he could do to help and how he could support me through this healing and if he could go to therapy with me. And, um, was incredibly, incredibly supportive. Um, and then not long after that, um, I continue to work on that trauma in therapy and I decided what I want to heal from this specific trauma is to report. Um, and it took me a while to get to that decision. Um, which is interesting cuz like I said, I don't feel like I need to report to heal from the trauma from my early childhood assault. Um, but then in it, I think in 2021 is when I first actually reported, cause it took me a while to, um, one, find the avenue to report to.
Um, cruise law is really, really confusing. Um, maritime law is, uh, for lack of better words, it's messed up. It's very messed up . Um, and I didn't know who to report to when I first told my therapist I wanted to report, um, she said to call rain. And, uh, so I called rain first, which again, rain is a fantastic resource. This is, I think, an interesting situation. Um, but when I called Ray and asked, uh, if I wanted to report an assault that happened a decade ago, where would I go? And they told me to report in the state where the crime was committed. And I said, that's not possible. It happened over international waters. Um, and they did not know where to send me. They were like, the best advice we can give you is report to the state where the crime was committed.
Maybe contact your local police department. Um, so then from there I went to, uh, the police department in Long Beach since that's where our crews left and came back to. And, um, they told me that they would call me back and then never call me back. Um, and I know again, the reporting process is so weird. It is so weird. And I feel like most times it's set up for peop for victims to fail, for survivors to fail. Um, and then from there I reported to my, uh, local police department and they were like, Nope, this is not where you're supposed to go. So I went to the Miami Police Department since most cruises leave out of there, I figured they'd have more information. And they sent me to the F B I where I, um, officially made a report, um, with my local F B I, uh, department.
And from there, again, I've, I know I talk a lot about this a lot on TikTok. I have found out just some weird things about Cruz law. And it just is so much more dangerous than I ever expected it to be. Um, and my assault happened in 2009. Uh, cruises were not required to report any crime to the F B I besides suspicious death that I'm putting suspicious death in quotes. So if they deem it suspicious, they can report it to the F B I, which, um, yes. Uh, but the Cruise Vessel Safety and Security Act of 2010, again, was passed in 2010. And that was when cruises were now required to report crimes, all crimes to the F B I. Um, so I think back to the timing of everything now, and had I reported my crime to the cruise ship, um, back in 2009, I think it would've gotten lost then too.
And I probably would have not done what I've done now cause I would've just put it behind me and not fully healed through it in the way I needed to. Um, cuz for a very long time, I was so upset that I didn't say anything then. Uh, and I know that when we don't say anything like our bodies are protecting themselves. I know the reason I didn't stop him on the cruise ship was because my body was protecting myself. The dissociation was a way to keep myself safe. Um, and, um, since then, like I said, I decided to share my story pretty publicly on TikTok. And I know that's how me and Deanna got connected. Um, and I found so much healing in publicly sharing my story, in being open about something that used to bring me so much shame and realizing that that shame isn't mine to carry.
:
It never was mine to carry. Um, and since I posted on TikTok, I actually found more people who were abused by the same person, the same employee on the cruise ship, um, which is not something I ever expected to come across. Um, it's something I was hoping I never would because that's not something you want to have in common with somebody. Um, but I think that there's a reason we were brought together and that we can share in that community. And knowing that I'm not alone in something that I thought I was for such a long time. Um, and that really helped put it into perspective for me, um, finding those other victims because I, again, I always thought that this was something that I had done to myself, and that somehow I had, I had been so mature that he couldn't resist sort of thing, you know?
And that sounds so awful to say. Um, but that was one of those deep rooted thoughts that I had. And then, especially when I started finding other people, it was like he had been prey on kids for a long time. And, um, yeah, I remember a therapist once told me, and I, I feel multiple ways about her saying this, but I remember her when I first disclosed, not when I first disclosed, but a couple weeks after her saying, um, imagine if there are other kids. Like, imagine if he did this to somebody else. And I remember feeling, again, lots of things. I felt so much shame for the fact that if I had reported earlier, maybe there wouldn't be other people. And at that time I didn't know that there were other victims. Um, but it also really, really, um, pushed me into, okay, this is something bad that happened that I need to heal through.
Um, this is not something that I did to myself. This is somebody who was hurting kids and hurting me, and I deserve healing. Um, like I said, not my shame to carry one bit. Um, but yeah, through talking about it, and I've found so much community, um, and I feel like shame a lot of things cloak themselves in shame when we don't understand them and when we can shine a light on them, even if we don't, um, we can't make them go away. We can't make the abuse go away, but when we can shine a light on something, we can see it for what it is and not all these other narratives that it's trying to disguise itself under. Um, which is what both of my abuse stories have been doing for so long. They had been disguising themselves as something else until I started going to therapy and realizing like, no, this is not something I did to myself. This was never my shame to carry. Um, the things I did as a response to the abuse were just my ways of trying to understand what had happened to me and also not my shame to carry. Um, and just that I'm not a, a ruined person, , you know, I, for a long time yes, I was scared of having kids for That reason.
DEANNA:
Yeah. I say that all the time actually. Like, I'm not broken, damaged, or unlovable. I didn't believe that a decade ago, but I am not. Right. You know, and, and just, again, it's working, acknowledging that we feel that shame and working through it and seeing where it came from and really relearning. We did nothing wrong. And, and we can look back and think, well, had I learned this, maybe I could have listened to, you know, Victor calls it an inner siren and a gut instinct. Had I had, I recognized that maybe I could have asked for help, like, you know, sooner. But we can't go back and we can't change that. Right. And, and that's a really, you know, that's a hard pill to swallow. And, you know, a couple of things that you said, and I I, I mean I take notes, right?
So, um, the first thing that you started at the very beginning by saying, you know, it's, it's our responsibility to heal. It's not our responsibility to report the amount of people that shame victims for not reporting is just, it's such a trigger for me because, uh, some people will use me reporting the way I did and getting justice as like, well, you did it right. Well, even when people do it right, there's not always, um, this ability for them to actually get the justice that they want. It is, it is really, really tough. So I think that's a beautiful thing. I really do.
TORRIE:
Absolutely. Thank you. Yeah. And it's wild because I constantly have to remind myself the only person who can stop abuse from happening is the abuser. It was never my responsibility, your responsibility, uh, victor's responsibility to stop the abuse that we, that we experienced. Um, and then also, yeah, in an ideal world, everybody would be able to report. That's in an ideal world, but we are living in a world we're reporting, um, oftentimes it doesn't go anywhere. And that's really unfortunate. I mean, if you look at the statistics on how many, you know, reports actually make it to trial, it's minuscule, minuscule compared to, you know, how many people walk free. And, um, yeah. It's just, it's wild. It's absolutely wild.
VICTOR:
Something that you said that is interesting to me is the whole idea, if you would've reported sooner than maybe you could have saved kids that were going through that. Well, first of all, I'm assuming you didn't even think there were was anybody else. Right? Right. And, and that's how I felt too. Like, and it, I only really realized this just about four or five years ago when I was presenting at a school where I was talking during the presentation, someone had asked me a question about why did you, you wait so long to talk about your abuse? And it was 11 years for me before I talked about it. But during that presentation, I actually thought, and I said it out loud, I said, wow, if I would've known, if I would've reported sooner, it's very possible that, you know, I don't know, he may have been abusing other kids.
I could have saved other kids. I mean, I don't hold guilt for, I have no guilt for that. I, I not at all. I never even, not even to this day, I don't look back, go, wow, I should have reported sooner because I reported when I reported. And, and that was my starting. That was my, that was the beginning of my healing when I finally did report. So I don't hold that. But it's just interesting when I look back, go, wow, I never thought that he might have been doing this to other kids until later in life. And I still don't know to this day, and I'm okay with that. But I, I just think that's why I do tell kids in a presentation that, you know, that's another, I don't really say it that often, but it's, it's important to share, right? You want it, I don't call it reporting, I just call it being able to share your voice and, and to not keep on safe secrets.
But there is an underlying message there that, uh, although I don't think it's important to share to kids, Hey, if you don't, you know, if you share, then you can maybe save other kids. Kids don't understand that. And I think kids, they're only thinking about themselves, which they should be, especially if they're, if they're going through this type of thing and, and they're, they're wondering when they should talk about it and how they should talk about it. But it is, you know, an underlying message that, you know, and I think, I think because we didn't have the education, you didn't have the education, it's very possible if we ha we may not have prevented it from happening, but we might have come to a, a, a quicker conclusion that, wait a second, what happened Wa was not only wrong, which I knew it was wrong when it happened, but at the same time, I didn't know what I could do with it.
Right. Because I literally thought I was the only one in the world that this happened to. So I felt I better not say anything because I I'm gonna get yelled at, or it's gonna be my fault. It is my fault. So I better not say anything. I'm gonna keep it a secret for 11 years. So. Right. That's why education is so important. But you are one courageous young lady, and I, I thank you, uh, for sharing everything that you've shared. It's, it's, it's totally inspirational. And, and I love, again, I'm all about, I have a process that I created in my head what I did to overcome the, or what I'm doing to overcome my things in my life. All my trauma is I decide that I don't want to be defined by it anymore. I decided to take ownership of it all. Not to blame myself, but to own the fact that I can't change what happened.
I can only change where I'm at now and tomorrow. And, um, and to find the opportunity, what's the lesson in what happened to me? And then the, the most important one I love is to create out of my pain. And I think what you're doing is just by, you know, I think going to therapy is a way to create out of your pain because you're talking about it, but now you're taking it to the, the next level, I think with your tos that it's a way for you to, to express yourself and to say, you know what? I, I'm not afraid to talk about this and I'm okay to talk about this, and I'm not wrong. In fact, I am a rockstar when it comes to my own personal life and that I can, I can do something to maybe say one thing that's gonna inspire someone who's listening on the other end. And I think that's what this is all about.
TORRIE:
Thank you. You So much power in community
DEANNA:
. Oh yeah. And I mean, I, I've seen it, um, both Torrie and myself have grown, um, communities on TikTok, which if you're not on TikTok, you should, should definitely go to it. Um, and, and I'll make sure in the, in the show notes that we, we link, you know, Torrie, your, your social media handles, as long as you're comfortable with that. Yeah. Um, because there's, you know, there's a lot of listeners that they, they feel such a connection to people that have found their voice and, and speak unapologetically. It. What, what we went through was never our fault. We thought it was. And that contributed to our silence. And I will say this too, Victor. Um, I, I do the same kind of thing. I, I tell kids, you know, when you use your voice, you inspire other kids, other people to do the same thing.
Uh, the priority is ourselves, the healing, the receiving help. But a really good side effect is you inspire others, you could help others. It is not your responsibility to prevent abuse from another abuser. It can't be right. My, my dad abused other family members after I became an adult, and I did blame myself and I felt horrible guilt over that for a long time. But that's not my fault. I could only come forward when I could come forward. And I'm doing what I can now with the knowledge that I do to help myself so I can help other people as well. And, and yeah. And, and I, I know, I know, um, you know, we need to wrap up, but b but before we do Tori, um, you know, the podcast is all about the ways that we heal every day. Yeah. Um, what is, and I know this is like kind of a really big question. What is one way that you are healing every day where you are right now?
TORRIE:
I would say biggest thing is staying in my body. I have dissociated for so long in my life. Uh, I just wanna be present and I stay present by grounding exercises, touching things. And you can't see it if you're not watching the video, but I'm holding a wooden ring because holding things keeps my sensations going. Um, and, um, being present now that I have a daughter, especially, I just wanna be in those moments with her. I wanna remember them. Um, and I want to stay grounded. And I know you've mentioned recently, um, grounded isn't always calm mm-hmm. . Um, but grounded is safe in my body. I am safe and in my body, and I am in control. I might always, not always be calm, um, but I am in control of my emotions and they're no longer taking over my entire life. Every time I have a trigger, I can, you know, stay in my body and work through those emotions and genuinely feel a full spectrum.
Um, yeah, staying grounded, staying grounded is how I heal every day and sharing my story. Um, like I said, I did not know, I genuinely did not know that other people experienced, um, sexual abuse at all, really, until I started talking about it. And seeing other people's stories and consuming that content that this happens so often. So, um, horrendously often, um, that talking about it, there's so much power in community. And like I said, shame is one of the most dangerous emotions, I think. Um, and when we're able to talk about something and shine a light on it, we might not be able to make it go away. Um, but I think it holds less power than when we're able to talk about these things.
VICTOR:
That's fantastic. What do you think, Deanna? Was that good or what?
DEANNA:
I think it was really good and, um, you know, not to be a weirdo to, we are, we're not very far from Torrie. Um, and one of the, one of the first times Torrie and I, uh, had spoken is cuz I saw she had a friend who was doing like a like, kind of like a craft fair right by us, where we live. And I was like, are you gonna be there? And I, uh, I I couldn't remember why I couldn't go or, or if you weren't gonna be there, what the deal was. But I remember thinking, how cool is it that through something like TikTok, a children's dancing app, that it has become this, this beautiful way to connect with people. Mm-hmm. and I, I'm, I'm so thankful for that and thank you so much for, for being a voice, for coming on here and, and really displaying your vulnerability. Um, you know, I I just made a TikTok earlier saying, you know, uh, so many survivors inspired me to be where I am today. And I think that I get to pay it forward by doing the same thing to help other people. Right. You know, it's, it's a beautiful thing. So thank you so much for, for being with us and taking the time. Thank
TORRIE:
You guys for having me. Thank you so much.
VICTOR:
That great. Uh, really quick, Torrie. Um, last thing is, uh, you know, every day before I go to bed, I write down my three wins for the day. And, uh, you're making my list because I think learning from you tonight is, uh, by far just, it was a highlight, one of the highlights of my day. So, uh, I'm very grateful and Deanna and I are both very grateful that you took the time to be with us tonight. So thank you so much. Thank you
TORRIE:
So much. I appreciate you so much. Both of you. And the work you guys are doing is literally life changing. Thank you.
VICTOR:
You're welcome. Hold on everyone we wanna say thank you for being with us today. Uh, again, be present, be playful, be powerful,
DEANNA:
And be happy. Be healthy. Be safe. Thank you everybody.
VICTOR:
Bye everyone.
EXIT:
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